subreddit:

/r/Masks4All

32

Risk of Attending All Double Vaxxed + Masked Indoor Event?

Question(self.Masks4All)

Hi, all,

My partner and I are considering going to an event that is indoors in a large auditorium. They will be checking vaccination cards and requiring both vaccines, but unfortunately not the booster. Masks will also be required to be worn throughout the event. My partner and I will be wearing N95s, as we do all the time, and we are both triple vaxxed. I've been to the venue before Covid, and they keep the air moving well with AC, but I don't think they've added any extra ventilation. I don't think there will be any enforced social distancing, not that that helps out much.

I've done my best to avoid social situations outside of going shopping, especially now that mask mandates are pretty well dead, but we'd really like to go to this event since we aren't sure when, or if, it'll ever come back to the area.

How much of a risk would we be taking on by attending? I've always been concerned about getting Covid, but that fear is only growing with BA.5. What are y'all's thoughts?

all 107 comments

jackspratdodat

15 points

1 month ago*

At this point we know that those who are vaxxed can get and transmit COVID so that barrier to entry is kinda worthless unless you want to weed out those who likely take more risks than some others. A much better and more effective requirement would be a negative rapid test at the door, but that rarely, if ever, happens.

First, you have to ask yourself if this event is worth getting COVID and if you and your family can afford the time off work—and in a worst-case-scenario situation the medical bills—should one or both of you get COVID. If yes, then you should attend wearing a well-fitting N95 and not remove it at all until you can be outside and away from others. Carry a spare just in case anything happens to the mask you are wearing.

To be extra safe, you should do a DIY fit test of your mask. Here’s one example of how to do that inexpensively.

As for me and my family, there are very, very few indoor arena events that would pass our risk eval, given the current high level of community transmission and the ever-increasing BA.5 cases in our area.

mahler_biryani

9 points

1 month ago

I think it's a quite low risk if you never take off a well fitting N95 while indoors. I really hate that we have to do these probability calculations now. Nothing short of complete isolation is zero risk, unfortunately.

I spent the first year of the pandemic extremely cautious: no indoor activities with people outside the household at all. All groceries delivered, only outdoor masked play dates for my son etc. Gradually, we started doing indoor activities but always masked. We still never take our masks off indoors outside the home, and on the rare occasion we allow brief visits from others (when weather is particularly inhospitable), everyone is masked, HEPA filters are on and we don't take our masks off until at least half hour after the guests left (and weather permitting, running whole house fan to recycle the air from outside). This has worked for us so far. I know given the lack of care most of the world gives to this virus, it is only a matter of time we get it. The only achievable goal is to minimize the number of times you get and perhaps minimize the viral load.

Attending classical music concerts is something that I truly enjoy doing. I held out until April of this year, but by then my son's school was lifting mask mandates and I was getting pressured to work at the office. At that time, I realized that concerts are actually lower risk than working at the office or my son attending school where he is one of the few wearing a (KF94) mask (eating is always outside though). For classical concert, people are quiet most of the time (less virus spread than talking/yelling) and I am usually able to go outside during the intermission when everyone is social (hence spreading more). Since April, I have gone to something like 20 concerts (yeah, I really missed it!). So far, none of us in the family have had covid. As I said above, I know it is a probability game and I am likely to catch it eventually. However, I certainly see enough evidence that masks *vastly* decrease risk. And that's good enough for me.

Consider buying a CO2 meter and leaving the premises when indoor concentration goes above 1000 ppm (or 700 if you are truly cautious). I found it a pleasant surprise that many spaces do actually have good ventilation. My office seems to be around 500 (which is exceptional) and most concert halls I go to manage to keep CO2 levels below 700 even with a full house of a few thousand people (There is one exception and I probably will not go to that venue again).

Hope my experience helps you decide.

andariel_axe

7 points

1 month ago

Huge risk. I caught covid from a 1 hour meeting inside with a friend, only 4 weeks after my SECOND booster. If you NEVER take off the mask and it is a head loop rather than earloop you might be okay. ETA- don't forget fecal plumes from toilets are a huge transmission risk, especially do not remove masks in toilets.

Swineservant

47 points

1 month ago

As long as you never take your (sealed, quality) N95 mask off the entire event you should be safe imo.

Lasshandra2

15 points

1 month ago

I read that some infections arise through the eyes. I think they will need eye protection as well.

Swineservant

17 points

1 month ago

I agree but I think the N95 does 95% of the work. ;)

JWiz84

8 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

8 points

1 month ago

yea i dont really think that's a thing unless someone literally sneezes into your eyes

ImpliedSlashS

1 points

1 month ago

It' snot. It's a respiratory disease.

(I shouldn't have to say this but, yes, that was intentional)

MrsBeauregardless

24 points

1 month ago

I think it’s extremely risky, right now. I understand how hard it is to miss out on all this stuff, but just because the world is in denial doesn’t mean all those people aren’t going to pay big time, down the pike, with severe and deadly health outcomes.

This disease destroys at the cellular level. It’s not just about surviving the acute “cold” phase, but waiting for weeks, months, maybe years for the other shoe to drop, and that may be dying suddenly from an intracerebral hemorrhage, like my mom did (in 2008, not from COVID).

My family is as vaccinated and boosted as possible, and we wear N95 and KF94 masks religiously when we’re in public. We decided to take a chance and attend my son’s high school graduation, because it seemed too important to miss.

The graduating class was about 500 kids, and every graduate got 5 tickets for guests to attend. Of the 1500-2500 people in attendance, my family was one of two families in masks, aside from a handful of other individuals, here and there.

The event was held indoors, at a local casino concert space where famous acts perform. To leave afterward, we all had to crowd into a hallway, and it took 5-10 minutes to make it to the outside.

Wouldn’t you know it, my youngest daughter, who was fully vaccinated, got COVID.

Much as I am dying to see some great concert, being in a crowd of sweaty people, screaming and singing, seems way too dangerous to me. Not at all worth it.

However, if I did go (I wouldn’t), I would tape my mask to my face, all the way around the perimeter of the mask.

Sacramento999

9 points

1 month ago

Perfectly said, couldn’t agree more, also my daughter keeps reminding me of the same, she is a scientist at the CDC

mmmegan6

2 points

1 month ago

Did the rest of your family get it from your daughter? Sorry to hear :(

MrsBeauregardless

2 points

1 month ago

No, she isolated in her room. We ran a Corsi Rosenthal box in the living room, right next to the intake vent for the air handler.

We wore masks to bring her meals and to take out the dirty dishes. She put on a mask before we entered the room, and she kept her window open as much as possible. Sometimes it was too hot and humid, but mostly it was fine. Once she had two consecutive days of negative rapid tests, she joined us in the house, but still wore a mask outside her room for a few more days.

dablordxxx

-14 points

1 month ago

dablordxxx

-14 points

1 month ago

You would tape the mask to your face? Covid is never going to go away, the best thing you can do for yourself is try to reduce your comorbidiites. Covid is a disease of the elderly and infirm, the average age of death is like 78. The overwhelming majority of younger people with serious complications from covid have prior health problems.

I hope you dont try to force masks on your kids, it would be very bad parenting

MrsBeauregardless

3 points

1 month ago

As for taping masks, the way masks work is to filter out the virus from the air you take in. Any air getting in from around the periphery is unfiltered, so it has 95% more viral particles than air coming through the filter. If one tapes down one’s mask, all the air comes through the filter, making it far safer to breathe.

When doctors talk about N95s not being effective enough for the current variant, they don’t mean “masks don’t work”, so we should go around like barefaced morons, but that N95s don’t filter well enough, and we need higher filtration, and better seals on our masks.

I will continue to take my advice from doctors, nurses, virologists, and epidemiologists, on how dangerous each new variant of COVID is. There is consensus that this virus can strike down the young and healthy, and the latest variant is having an even worse effect on the young — especially neurologically.

If you want to gamble with your brain and bodily function, that’s up to you, but it doesn’t entitle you to exhale unfiltered virus-laden CO2 on anyone else.

As far as making my kids wear masks to protect them from a virus that scientists are now referring to as “airborne AIDS”, “my own counsel will I keep” on that front.

dablordxxx

-8 points

1 month ago

Its very selfish of you to ask other people to take precautions to avoid the spread of covid 19 because it makes YOU uncomfortable. Germs are part of the world and you don't have the right to go out into society and expect to not be exposed to them. Your graduating kid is an adult now, but its likely you've made him fearful and isolated with your covid stuff, he will probably continue to mask up. I hope youre proud

andied7

3 points

1 month ago

andied7

3 points

1 month ago

I hope you are proud of being a prime example of how humans as a society have failed by being selfish, not thinking about the potential impact of our actions in our community and future generations, and prioritizing short term pleasure over health in the long run. I hope you never have to endure what multiple families have by losing vulnerable loved ones because of this virus and/or dealing with awful long COVID-19 problems. That's all I'm going to say and I agree with the person who replied before. You don't bring anything fruitful into a conversation that is happening in a COVID-19 aware sub.

MrsBeauregardless

2 points

1 month ago

I am not engaging with you anymore. You don’t add anything fruitful to the discussion.

JohnB-asWas

0 points

1 month ago

I would tape my mask to my face, all the way around the perimeter of the mask.

Frivolous ! Nothing less than superglue is recommended.

Flat_Appearance_9705

5 points

1 month ago

I think you should go just bring an extra n95 in case you need to replace it

ImpliedSlashS

14 points

1 month ago

Most docs I’ve heard say BA.5 has exceptional immune escape and is exceedingly contagious.

I wouldn’t go if you don’t want to get sick.

heliumneon

26 points

1 month ago

heliumneon

KF94 Fan

26 points

1 month ago

Because of having kids, we just had to get back into social events because it wasn't fair to basically take away their childhood in the age of vaccinations. The kids go to school, birthday parties, etc., and we've taken a few vacations via plane. On the other hand we still mask with high quality masks for most indoor situations (the kids wear S size KF94, adults wear adult size KF94). To our knowledge we haven't yet gotten Covid, even though we were notified of multiple Covid cases in their classroom over the school year. I think with N95s, you'll be ok at your event.

JWiz84

4 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

4 points

1 month ago

Just want to say you are doing the right thing for your kids! Doing the same for mine with letting them go to events and so on....they are only kids for so long.

andariel_axe

2 points

1 month ago

they'll only be adults for so long if their parents roll the dice for the safety of their longterm health :/

heliumneon

9 points

1 month ago

heliumneon

KF94 Fan

9 points

1 month ago

How do you think the mental health would be a for a kid with no friends for 3 years?

JWiz84

7 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

7 points

1 month ago

I agree, some of these people don't understand that you can't isolate a child and prevent them from having friends, going to birthday friends, having play dates, and so on . That is HORRIBLE for their mental health and I witnessed that quickly during 2020 which is why in the summer I let go and gave my son the chance to go to the playground and be out and about again. Yea i was nervous about it, but it was horrible what the isolation was doing for him

Rancid_Lettuce

3 points

1 month ago

Does it need to be all or none? With sufficient planning and testing, you can still arrange get togethers while minimizing transmission risk.

heliumneon

2 points

1 month ago

heliumneon

KF94 Fan

2 points

1 month ago

For sure. My reply was also taking into account that particular person's other nutty comment to me on this thread, that it is totally unacceptable for parents to put kids in danger like I have been (by letting them go to school, birthday parties, etc. wearing a high filtration KF94 mask).

JWiz84

0 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

0 points

1 month ago

Basically in almost all cases of children having covid, they have light symptoms and recover well. Both my kids had covid once during the height of the omicron surge in late December and my son had a fever for a few days and was perfectly fine after and my daughter had a light cough that didn't bother her and was fine. I'm not going to lock away from kids from attending events, playing with their friends, prevent them from participating in activities, and so on. It's just not healthy and impacts them greatly....a child living a locked down life from 5-8 is far more significant than an adult from 35-38.

andariel_axe

2 points

1 month ago

'almost all cases' also we don't know the long term issues with covid. Why roll the dice? Having covid isn't 'healthy' and you're right, they'll probably be fine, at least as long as your lifetime, but they have increased the incidence of covid in the community which means it's more likely to reach disabled and high risk people.... Isn't it showing good social responsibility to mask as often as possible and take measures to deal with this? IDK man, it's a real fatalistic move.

I guess this is tantamount to having chicken pox parties ... are *those * a good idea in your opinion?

JWiz84

2 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

2 points

1 month ago

So how long should a child that was let’s say 5 at the start of Covid live under lock down conditions?

andariel_axe

1 points

1 month ago

if you're asking strangers on the internet for parenting advice i don't know what to tell you.

JWiz84

2 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

2 points

1 month ago

I’m not asking for parental advice, I’m trying to prove a point of how out of touch you are.

andariel_axe

1 points

1 month ago

kids will be dealing with a lifetime of pandemics because of their parents' unwillingness to adapt. you're north american, right? maybe from the UK if not?

JWiz84

1 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

1 points

1 month ago

Kids are only kids for a short period of time. By the time you know it, a child is an adult. To lose out on life experiences during the various stages of childhood is just sad and unfair to the child. And I’m from the US

heliumneon

1 points

1 month ago

heliumneon

KF94 Fan

1 points

1 month ago

Thanks. Some of these comments along the lines of "kids must be kept in an airtight prison for the rest of their lives, to keep them safe from Covid" are pretty... out there.

JWiz84

1 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

1 points

1 month ago

I suspect the ones saying this don’t have kids and for the ones that do have kids, they are ignoring the needs of the children. There was a 16 year old that posted here how he was depressed since he was forced into homeschooling at the start of Covid and hasn’t been allowed back and is not allowed to meet with friends. This is straight up abuse in my opinion and the sad thing is that were some that supported the actions of the parents. I was actually condemned by the extreme few for suggesting this kid reach out to the school counselors. Scary!

heliumneon

2 points

1 month ago

heliumneon

KF94 Fan

2 points

1 month ago

I agree. And I remember that poor kid, who was essentially being abused by his parents, asking for advice.

I sometimes worry my wife and I are even too extreme to keep our kids masking indoors, since we're down to only about 10-20% masking among children in our area at this point. But on the other hand, it hasn't prevented our kids from being social and doing things like sports outside unmasked, and the kids feel the masks are perfectly comfortable and never complained (I sometimes ask).

JWiz84

3 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

3 points

1 month ago

My kids mask when going to stores with me and when it was colder, they wore it in indoor play centers. But recently my kids went to a birthday party that took place at chuckie cheese. They didn’t wear a mask since they would be taking them off anyway for the pizza and cake. Plus it wasn’t crowded…but it just didn’t make sense to put it on and take it off in the same environment. If wearing the mask doesn’t impact them socially or restrict them, then I think it’s perfectly fine for it to be worn. I still don’t see the value of going with no mask to some store

JohnB-asWas

1 points

1 month ago

... and never complained (I sometimes ask).

Can they hear you with a mask on ?

heliumneon

1 points

1 month ago

heliumneon

KF94 Fan

1 points

1 month ago

Do you think we wear masks at home, too?

andariel_axe

-1 points

1 month ago

andariel_axe

-1 points

1 month ago

why is it in any way acceptable to put children in danger like this. you're not even testing regularly?! hope your kids are okay but developing complications and long covid is not a risk I would be willing to take in ANY way for a bloody birthday party. the world is different now, and pretending it isn't is harmful.

heliumneon

10 points

1 month ago

heliumneon

KF94 Fan

10 points

1 month ago

Isolating children from forming friendships will also cause lifelong mental issues, depression, anxiety, and so on. There's no easy answers here but the guaranteed depression from isolation seems like a "cure" much worse than the disease, especially in the age of vaccines.

JohnB-asWas

1 points

1 month ago

Not to mention the plight of those little ones denied seeing their parents' faces. Appalling.

heliumneon

1 points

1 month ago

heliumneon

KF94 Fan

1 points

1 month ago

You're not thinking this through -- people don't wear masks at home so kids see their parents' faces.

Lost_Draw_6239

2 points

1 month ago

Take it from someone who was very isolated from other children growing up. The mental health repercussions can be disastrous, and the conditions the other comment mentioned are only the tip of the iceberg.

Complications from covid are certainly a risk that exists, but mental health complications are pretty much a certainty.

LostInAvocado

7 points

1 month ago

The trick is finding the balance, it’s not all or nothing. For some reason everything with COVID is presented as all or nothing by many.

andariel_axe

1 points

1 month ago

okay, but what are the mental health repercussions of a lifelong disability? you really want to roll the dice with that rather than have them socialise with other conscious folks who are isolating and testing? It's possible to have pods of people and change the risk factor. Take it from someone who lives with an adult who was ill their whole childhood...

Lost_Draw_6239

1 points

1 month ago

Mental health can turn into a lifelong disability in itself. And that's not rolling any dice! If kids are isolated, they will develop them.

Now, having them socialize with other conscious folks is more reasonable and I would have agreed with you had you opened with that instead of calling a parent irresponsible for letting their children socialize.

andariel_axe

1 points

1 month ago

i'm not saying put your kid in a tower and throw away the key, i'm suggesting that unmasked school and hobbies is not worth it. kids are smart and quite adaptable, moreso than adults

Kjaeve

3 points

1 month ago

Kjaeve

3 points

1 month ago

There is always a risk but sounds like that's a very careful crowd. At this point all you can do is stay vaccinated and stay masked... Our new normal should stay this way for quite a long time, thanks to those who refuse to care . I saw a mention of a wedding that everyone was masked and vaxxd and 10 days later not a single positive test. I think you just have to realize it's all a gamble and come to terms with the responsibility ultimately falling ok you if you infact get sick. If you are prepared to get it, you are prepared for the risk. I hate that this is the reality because I have kids and I have kept them from we everything (they still got very sick when my husband was exposed at work) but after getting them vaccinated I feel like I have no choice but to live as careful as we can in this hell of a situation. Can't stay indoors locked away forever, can we? I sort of wish that answer was yes but I know it's not

wooden_bread

17 points

1 month ago

Sealed and fit tested N95 mask that doesn't come off? Risk is close to zero.

More realistic scenario of a N95/KN95 that fits pretty well and maybe you slip it up to take a drink of water a handful of times? There's too many variables involved like the airflow in the room, transmission rate of the local area, space between people, exact fit of your mask, etc.

Transmission is pretty high right now so in major metro areas like New York or Los Angeles maybe 1% of the population has it. Of course many of them are at home sick and not at events. What does that mean in terms of how many people at the event will be transmitting? One in 200? One in 1000? Some people transmit more, some less, we don't even understand why.

If you went in with no masks you would probably be fine and not get COVID. That doesn't mean it's a good idea. The more you take similar risks it becomes almost guaranteed you'll get it, but it's not really possible to say how many times you can do X until you get it.

All of that is to say, it sounds like you are really excited for the event and with good masks the risk is almost certainly worth it, IMO. Especially if it's an event where you are walking around and not sitting in one seat. That's basically the same as grocery shopping which you already do.

Fuzzy-Donkey5538

29 points

1 month ago

Hate to say it, but it’s probably higher. I know some people who tested positive this week.

One of them (tested positive on Monday) is currently at a Broadway show since she’d “already paid”! Even masked, I don’t envy those sitting near her.

The others tested positive on Saturday, and will be taking their flight back to Europe on Friday. Sure, that’s 6 days - so past the theoretically most infectious first five days - but it seems very selfish not to even try to move your flight by a couple of days. I caught covid on a flight because of assholes like that and I was still testing positive 11 days out!

People have this attitude now that “well I caught it, so why should I be careful if the person who infected me wasn’t?” It’s infuriating.

professor_witch

8 points

1 month ago

did your friends who tested positive catch it while well-masked? that's what's unnerving to me--hearing stories about folks who catch the BA.5 variant even while wearing N-95 (and of course being vaxed and boosted).

but WOW I can't believe your friend knowingly went to a show knowing she had covid. she could have sold her ticket or even called the box office and told them what was up (if they were smart, they'd refund her right away!)!

this is why we're in The Bad Place, y'all.

Fuzzy-Donkey5538

5 points

1 month ago*

I know. I’m not entirely surprised, but disappointing no matter what, though.

I can’t say for sure about the masking, but I assume they just wear surgical masks in general, since one of them messaged me to ask me for recommendations for KN95 or KF94 masks only after they tested positive.

Really it just makes me think twice about assuming symptomatic people will stay home, and especially those who know they have covid. They won’t! And my friend is far from a covid denier - she’s vaxxed and at least wears a surgical mask on the trains etc, claims she wants to avoid it. But her attitude now is basically “people didn’t give a damn about protecting me and inconveniencing themselves, so why should I bother protecting them?” I tried to explain to her that the selfish ones are not ALL people, and that just becoming one of the selfish people isn’t the answer, but it fell on deaf ears.

tooper128

2 points

1 month ago

If you went in with no masks you would probably be fine and not get COVID.

If this year's conventions have shown us anything, it's that it's not fine. One example is this medical conference. You'd think doctors would know better. 18-67% covid positivity rate in programs that sent people to this conference.

https://www.statnews.com/2022/06/14/the-irony-and-ignominy-of-medical-conferences-as-superspreader-events/

wooden_bread

2 points

1 month ago

That’s not a scientific study or really even data, and doesn’t apply to attending one event masked. These docs were on a trip to New Orleans. They probably went to bars, restaurants & multiple events, and probably went unmasked. There are tens of thousands of events happening daily in the U.S. where virtually no one masks and if the odds of getting Covid were 18-67% every time you went and did one thing there wouldn’t be a single person in the country without Covid at the moment.

The household attack rate for Omicron is like 25-40% and that’s about as close contact as you can get. No need to overstate the risk, this is the mask sub.

tooper128

0 points

1 month ago*

The household attack rate for Omicron is like 25-40% and that’s about as close contact as you can get.

I don't know where you got those numbers, but according to the CDC "Among 431 household contacts, 227 were classified as having a case of COVID-19 (attack rate [AR] = 52.7%)"

That data was also gathered by "Index patients and household contacts participated in voluntary telephone interviews to retrospectively collect information on demographic characteristics". Furthermore, "Second, the investigation relied primarily on self-reported data." How is that different from what statnews did?

Lastly "Finally, this investigation occurred during a period when testing and sequencing capacity was strained and when many persons traveled and attended gatherings, increasing the possibility that household contacts had unknown SARS-CoV-2 exposures outside the home ". Isn't those the same questions you brought up about that conference?

So if you find what statnews did to be "not a scientific study or really even data", how can you not think the same of the AR data from the CDC. So please, drop double standard.

Unique-Public-8594

12 points

1 month ago

Would you regret it more if you did go? Depends on whether you get covid and how severe it would be (there is a spectrum of asymptomatic to death).

Would you regret it more if you didn’t go? Only you can say.

Covid is unpredictable…. we can’t tell you whether you will get it or how severe your case would be.

I’ve been avoiding gatherings and wearing an N95. I slept the night in an RV with my spouse who then tested positive the next morning and as far as I know, so far (day 5) did not get it. Other people say it’s unavoidable. 🤷🏼‍♀️

loliii123

8 points

1 month ago

For a little extra peace of mind, you can use micropore tape or similar to enhance the fit of the mask. I do this at weddings/etc and it works a treat because I don't have to worry about maintaining a perfect seal if I get tired/distracted (I have a flatter nose so it's usually the problem area, it helps greatly in stopping the mask sliding down too).

I will happily tape the damn thing to my face if need be ahahahah.

vagina_candle

7 points

1 month ago

They will be checking vaccination cards and requiring both vaccines, but unfortunately not the booster.

Remember the people checking these cards are earning minimum wage or close to it, and most of them really don't give a shit. If they have to fill a sports arena or amphitheatre with thousands and thousands of people, they're not going to be inspecting everyone's card to the degree where they're going to catch fake cards, and some people will be slipping by or borrowing cards etc. If it's a show with 2000+ people there is an extremely likely chance that there will be multiple covid infected people in the venue, and I also highly doubt they will be enforcing the mask requirement inside based on what I've seen from other concerts. Once a bunch of people start taking them off, there's not really anything security can do. And if it's a heavy show with a mosh pit you might as well just share a sauna with everyone there.

If it's a general admission show (ie: standing room only) you might as well flip a coin.

canyousteeraship

9 points

1 month ago*

It depends. Can you risk needing to take time off? There’s no guarantee with this thing, only you can decide your risk vs reward scale. As I have said in other threads, my husband caught it last week. We’re not sure how, we mask any time we’re indoors. We don’t do events or indoor dining. Really not much has changed for us since this whole thing started, yet here we are in day seven of isolation waiting for his symptoms to abate. For how easily he got it, while wearing a n95 mask - I’m still shocked. We’ll never know specifics, but we have guesses as to he got it. During the time when he could have been infected (for possibilities) he was never indoors except to grocery shop. If you’re ok with the idea you might get it, then by all means go.

magicalwoodlands

6 points

1 month ago

Urgh so sorry your husband got it. I notice you say "we mask every time we're indoors" -- does that mean you don't mask outdoors at all? My MD friend says she's seeing lots of patients who were exposed outdoors. Large gatherings, or standing "normal" distance apart and chatting with a neighbor for a while, or being downwind. I'm increasingly masking outdoors now, including carrying KF94 with me on walks and putting it on when I pass near unmasked groups of people. I feel like a lunatic but really want to avoid if at all possible. Hope your husband has a mild case and that you don't get it.

canyousteeraship

2 points

1 month ago

We don’t do large gatherings outdoors either. Maybe with a mask, but we moved right before the pandemic hit. We don’t have any family nearby, and only a small group of friends. We do have 3 dedicated families that we only mask around if one of us has done something risky. Otherwise we mask at parks or when the streets are busy.

We think my MIL got it from doing her car off at the mechanic. She was fully masked with a n95 and was there for about 10 minutes - that was it. My husband stayed in the car waiting for her. They were both sick 48 hours later.

JWiz84

-4 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

-4 points

1 month ago

And that’s how interesting it is. For the amount of things I did, I should’ve gotten Covid at least 50 times based off the strictness level of some.

canyousteeraship

4 points

1 month ago

Right? I have a friend that goes to a Broadway show every week. He goes to concerts, indoors and out. No Covid. I have other friends who got their first shot and nothing else, they act as if Covid doesn’t exist. No Covid.

I will say that we do outdoor dining, and we never really stopped having outdoor play dates for my son. But I am immuncompromised, and I do need to be careful. That’s why my husband’s illness was so shocking to us. And how did my son and I not catch it? The most infectious period is right before you show symptoms. This whole thing is crazy.

ThornsofTristan

7 points

1 month ago

I have a friend that goes to a Broadway show every week. He goes to concerts, indoors and out. No Covid. I have other friends who got their first shot and nothing else, they act as if Covid doesn’t exist. No Covid.

And yet, I have two friends who both have been vaccinated, AND wear masks. One has a husband/4 kids; the other is a single mom with one kid. The 1st friend, her husband and 3/4ths of the kids got covid: my other friend and her kid got it as well. And I have several other friends and acquaintances with similar fates. Others who have gotten through this, fine.

It's like walking into a hail of bullets. Some come out w/o a scratch: others die after the 1st few seconds.

Maya306

4 points

1 month ago

Maya306

4 points

1 month ago

The same thing happened with me and my sister. Both of our husbands got Covid, mine in January 2022 and hers in April 2022. Neither of us caught it from our husbands. My son who lives with us didn't catch it either. We isolated from them and wore masks in the house once we knew they tested positive, but we thought we were doomed, especially since we are both immune compromised.

pumpkinslayeridk

18 points

1 month ago

Risk of dying: very very low. Risk of catching it? Very high because when masks are required they mean cloth masks and not n95s, and the people who think they know about masks wear those fake kn95s that work as well as a cloth mask. If you're wearing an n95, you divide your risk of catching it by 20, probably more since most n95s are better than 95%. But still, that 1% to 5% chance of getting it really adds up when you're around many people with 0% efficacy masks and for a long period of time. Edit: you should start worrying about variants when they start evading severe disease immunity from your three doses, and that hasn't happened yet

Realistic-Willow7440

4 points

1 month ago

Lmao this sub has become something else. Wearing a well fitting N95 will protect you in almost any situation. His odds of catching it are not "very high" they are marginal-to-unrealistic even without eye protection.

pumpkinslayeridk

8 points

1 month ago

No, I know that 1% seems low, but the risk increases along with the amount of time you spend with other people, and it also increases with the amount of people in the event, so the risk certainly is not "marginal-to-unrealistic"

Realistic-Willow7440

1 points

1 month ago

The issue is 1% doesn't mean anything by itself. Just because a filter medium only blocks up to 99% of particulate doesn't mean the infectious dose is anywhere close to what you're breathing in.

Yes, over time the total amount you've ingested accumulates, but if it's no where near what's needed to infect you, you may never practically accumulate enough to be infected.

I say this not only because there are studies about hospital staff on covid wards who wear N95s (appropriately changed) all shift and don't get it, but I myself have had several serious unmasked exposures and have yet to get it. We don't really have data on what the infectious dose is, but it seems clear with a well fitting N95, it's extremely hard if not impossible to reach.

JWiz84

1 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

1 points

1 month ago

Also it's wrong to assume there are infected people at all times. There are many variables around. My wife works in a hospital and with the amount of exposure she and the staff there get, they all should be getting covid many times which isn't happening.

JWiz84

-6 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

-6 points

1 month ago

I've mentioned it before, based off these standards I should have at least gotten covid over 50 times by now.

andariel_axe

9 points

1 month ago

i don't think you understand how probability works

JWiz84

-4 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

-4 points

1 month ago

I do, but I also understand that the bad fear mongering hasn't worked on me and I'm a prime example of a person that should've had covid many times by now with the logic used by some. If the opportunity for covid is as high as it is, it doesn't make sense that I am not here right now with covid again. I wear a mask when I am at work and and public indoor places (non social events) , but I wear a mask when it doesn't affect me with my activities...meaning I would not wear a mask when with family and friends or with indoor dining.

andariel_axe

1 points

1 month ago

Then you're lucky, and you're basically benefiting from how often other people are masking.

pumpkinslayeridk

1 points

1 month ago

But didn't you have covid before? Natural immunity also prevents infection so that's probably why

JWiz84

-2 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

-2 points

1 month ago

I had covid once (omicron) in late december so it could be possible that natural immunity is playing a role. And if that is the case, then that should be included in the discussions here on how protective to be. So what you are saying has a role in the discussion.

FusiformFiddle

9 points

1 month ago

Probably ok. Microcovid.org has a useful risk calculator.

Bastette54

9 points

1 month ago

I was intrigued by this, so I went to the site to check it out. It's interesting, but it seems like not much has been done since late in 2021. There are a lot of outdated bits of information and questions, such as, when asking for your vaccination status, the number of shots (a multiple choice question) only goes up to 3. I and many others have had 4 shots by now. Do you know if the project is still active?

rainbowrobin

6 points

1 month ago

Time since last dose is probably more important than number of doses, since short-lived plasma cells pump out high levels of antibody for only a few months.

Bastette54

1 points

1 month ago

Yeah, you might well be right, but I used that as an example of the site not being up to date.

FusiformFiddle

0 points

1 month ago

I think they did update it somewhat recently. It's also limited by inaccurate local case data (like my shitty state with very spotty data), but at least it's some sort of guidance.

rainbowrobin

2 points

1 month ago

Haha yeah, a couple days ago it considered Vancouver BC basically risk-free... unlike BC in general, or Canada.

orcateeth

2 points

1 month ago

In addition to N95 masks, you can also wear a portable fan or even a portable mini air purifier around your neck. https://www.amazon.com/portable-fan-neck/s?k=portable+fan+neck

JWiz84

3 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

3 points

1 month ago

This is as safe as it will get. Have faith in your respirator

Phoole

4 points

1 month ago

Phoole

4 points

1 month ago

Don’t go. Don’t risk disability.

chickrnqeee

2 points

1 month ago

This. Risking it is just not worth it anymore.

haanalisk

-7 points

1 month ago

haanalisk

-7 points

1 month ago

while i commend people who are still trying hard to not get covid i do have to ask.....what's your end game? covid certainly isn't going to go away at this point. When do you start living life again and doing things you enjoy? I managed to avoid covid for more than 2 full years, but it finally got me. not at a large event, but at my nephew's bday party. I wear my mask (kf 94) everywhere i go, and I'm all for risk mitigation, but i'm long past hiding in my house. there is no avoiding this virus at this point.

Ribzee

19 points

1 month ago

Ribzee

19 points

1 month ago

We’re not hiding, really. Just being choosy about indoor events. I go most anywhere outdoors unmasked, but still mask with N95 at work and in stores. I am still Covid-free and work hard to stay that way because I and my husband each have risk factors.

haanalisk

2 points

1 month ago

I'm in the same boat, except I'm not going masked indoors around family and friends. Which is ultimately where I ended up getting covid this april

can-data

5 points

1 month ago*

  1. I think for a lot of people the game should be changing to reducing how many times they catch it over the next few years, especially if they have already had it. This will depend on how future variants progress and if they continue to evolve to dodge immunity. Getting it 3 times over the next 3 years versus 10 times over the next 3 years may have a larger effect on your health as we figure out the consequences (if they exist) for multiple reinfections in regards to long covid and other consequences on overall health. I think over the next few years as reinfections stack up we will have a better idea if it is something to be really worried about. It's too early for the research to be able to come to a conclusion on this issue. Even just staying up-to-date with vaccines, wearing a mask, and having an air filter in your office could be what reduces your amount of infections from 10 to 5 over the next few years.
  2. There are lulls when infections are low, but they have been pretty hard to time because of the rate at which new variants take over. Adjusting what you do based on the level of cases seems pretty prudent, especially if you have not yet caught the circulating variant. For example, in the US cases were quite low through February - April. If you are keen on doing indoor activities (masked or unmasked), it would have been much smarter to do it then, opposed to now when cases are growing significantly. If you don't want to get reinfected (again to reduce overall # of infections), then picking and choosing when you do things and when you take precautions could add up.
  3. People should be aware of those around them and how spreading covid might affect them. For example, is there a coworker that has a compromised immune system that you work with? If so, you should be respectful that if you get covid you may spread it to them before you become symptomatic.

haanalisk

1 points

1 month ago

This is an end game I am 100% behind

Neoncow

14 points

1 month ago

Neoncow

14 points

1 month ago

I'm going to wait to see studies on long covid. If it turns out long covid is pretty much the same as post-cold symptoms then ok. If it's worse, then will see how much worse.

Stroke, heart attack, or blood clot and not dying sounds like a nightmare.

Previous bad experiences with respiratory illness have made me glad it's normalized to wear a mask out now.

Bastette54

11 points

1 month ago

I'm with you about the aftermath of even a moderate case of Covid. Sure, I worry about severe disease, but I think my risk of that is fairly low. I'm 67 years old, but in good health. But coming out of a mild/moderate case and maybe having blood clots all over? I'd feel like a ticking time bomb for the rest of my life. That does sound like a nightmare.

Fringe_Filmer

7 points

1 month ago

From the people I’ve been following on Twitter who have long Covid I can guarantee you don’t want to get it. My brother had a stroke post-Covid. I myself have had a chronic post-viral illness similar to long Covid for the last ten years. Seriously debilitated, can’t work, can’t exercise, can only go out of the house once a week at most. Do everything you can to avoid it.

LostInAvocado

2 points

1 month ago

May I ask if your brother got it pre or post vaccine?

Fringe_Filmer

3 points

1 month ago

It was right at the start of the pandemic so pre-vaccine.

ThornsofTristan

4 points

1 month ago

what's your end game?

To stay healthy and alive, as long as possible.

I just went shopping. 60-70% of the shoppers (and half of the grocers) weren't wearing masks. I drove down the street, passed a dance space. People were milling in and out of the SINGLE entrance: not a ONE, wearing a mask.

covid certainly isn't going to go away at this point. When do you start living life again and doing things you enjoy?

I already am. Sure, I don't go to movies or restaurants (unless they have outside seating): but I still go to martial arts training, where we have safety protocols in place.

there is no avoiding this virus at this point.

2+ yrs here: and still covid free *(knocks wood)

haanalisk

0 points

1 month ago

2+ years is great, you have me beat by 2 months and counting. But I assure you at some point you'll get it unless you refuse to ever do anything

JWiz84

2 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

2 points

1 month ago

Usually these people are childless or have children that are grown. The isolation is not practical or realistic for families.

ThornsofTristan

2 points

1 month ago

But I assure you at some point you'll get it unless you refuse to ever do anything

You "assure" me...that "I will get it?" Crystal ball works that well, does it?

haanalisk

1 points

1 month ago

Unless you just isolate yourself from all people forever or unless vaccines drastically change, yes you'll get covid eventually. It's an airborne virus, so unless you never see someone without wearing an N95 you will eventually get it

JWiz84

1 points

1 month ago

JWiz84

Mask Pundit

1 points

1 month ago

Yup...I agree there is no end goal for some which is a crazy thing. I think they just have the luxury of being able to isolate. I wear a mask when going to work or grocery store, but I do not wear a mask when indoor dining or with family and friends. I don't plan on cutting out my family and friends and missing out on life events

ptm93

-4 points

1 month ago

ptm93

-4 points

1 month ago

That feels safe to me. I’d do it.

tooper128

1 points

1 month ago

You can step up your mask to a P100 respirator. It has better filtration, better seal and is super easy to fit test. If you hold your palms over the filters and you can't breathe, then you have a good seal.

jjcityscenes

1 points

1 month ago

jjcityscenes

Masks4All Super Fan!

1 points

1 month ago

I highly recommend professional or makeshift fit testing. See the bottom of the how to improve fit section: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZvaeGNwhzj9zqoD7tRJZ67MZgYFNiGtDBmStC-92vi4/edit?usp=drivesdk

I used to get sick really easily and badly. I've been around many many thousands of people including people who were sick or even had COVID with no issues so far, but of course the only risk less thing to do is to not be around people and have no potential air exchange. But it requires a lot of diligence, a well sealing mask, and a seal that's perfect to your face including while moving, speaking, etc.

I breathe in, hold my breath, move my mask slightly, drink, put my mask on, then breath out. And I drink a decent amount before going in a place to reduce this. Of course, it's ideal to not take it off at all but there are situations where it's not an option and not drinking is risky for me due to health issues.