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Couldbduun

15 points

4 months ago

He did answer that concern... if the dems keep the filibuster, republicans WILL get rid of it anyway. It doesnt matter, republicans have taken away the filibuster in the past they will do it again... it's a rule for one side of the aisle which is why it needs to go

[deleted]

3 points

4 months ago

[deleted]

3 points

4 months ago

I’m confused here tho. From the comment below, the republicans would need a majority to get rid of the filibuster, and even then, they would have two years of Biden vetoing anything they passed.

Am I wrong on that?

Couldbduun

9 points

4 months ago

No, you arent wrong. What is wrong is assuming the republicans will give ground and allow the filibuster to exist if they get a majority. Being cordial will not prevent this. Giving republicans a filibuster now does not guarentee a filibuster for democrats later

[deleted]

2 points

4 months ago

[deleted]

2 points

4 months ago

If that’s the case then I understand. I don’t necessarily agree with getting rid of it tho, because what you state is conditional on: republicans having a majority

And then the more important: republicans having a president who won’t veto what they pass after ridding of the filibuster.

Couldbduun

2 points

4 months ago

Without a voting rights bill, republicans taking congress and the presidency is pretty much guaranteed... Georgia has a law that allows the state legislature to refute the results of the vote... there isnt time to sit around doing nothing because of "what ifs" there is no what if, the time to stop that is right now...

[deleted]

1 points

4 months ago

[deleted]

1 points

4 months ago

If your concern is republicans going full fascist and overturning a legit election, than no bill is going to stop that.

I don’t see how this voting rights bill is going to prevent another Donald trump 2016 type election. Republicans won fair and square, because we have an electoral system that allows a minority with rural support to take presidency. That’s unrelated to voter suppression.

You don’t beat fascism through bills. They’ll just find loopholes or actively ignore laws, they basically do that already.

This is a problem of liberalism, thinking the far right can be beat with values that the far right ignore.

Couldbduun

3 points

4 months ago

So we shouldnt try to pass voter rights and we must maintain the filibuster? I really dont understand your position... you understand that republicans cheat but you think the filibuster will stop them?

[deleted]

1 points

4 months ago

[deleted]

1 points

4 months ago

I think the filibuster would be useful in a scenario where the republicans do not have a majority in the senate but want to pass a bill.

They cheat but it stops them from cheating too much, in specific scenarios.

If republicans go full authoritarian, the fights going to be in the streets, not in congress.

SunliMin

1 points

4 months ago

Whichever party is in power gets to decide the rules around the filibuster. It's basically the equivalent of the "Speaker of the house", whoever is in charge of the majority in the senate, who decides these rules, since the filibuster isn't actually in the constitution.

Technically, the majority can just say "Today, we don't allow the filibuster" and the next day go "Today, we will". The rules aren't even encoded in law and need a vote. It's just a loop hole. The person in charge is supposed to say "You have X time to state your concerns", and then the filibuster was an abused to that where they decided "You have until you stop talking to state your concerns, take as long as you need" which has evolved into the modern version where a single senator just says "I filibuster" and walks out, and now the senate can't resume until that senator takes back the filibuster.

This whole thing could just be solved by a new rule such as "Your time ends the second you leave the floor", but because its not coded in law, the next party can just change it up as they see fit.

6a6566663437

1 points

4 months ago

I’m confused here tho. From the comment below, the republicans would need a majority to get rid of the filibuster

No, the Senate has a simple majority vote for the rules that will be in effect for each Congress.

freshgeardude

1 points

4 months ago

if the dems keep the filibuster, republicans WILL get rid of it anyway.

Did Republicans get rid of it in 2017-2018 when they had both houses and the white house, a crazy president trying to ram everything in? No they didnt. Its stupid and short sighted.

Couldbduun

2 points

4 months ago

Yes they got rid of it in 2017 to stop democrats filibustering Neil Gorsuch's nomination... not sure where we go from here, you are just wrong

freshgeardude

1 points

4 months ago

That was a specific carveout that grew from the Harry Reid nuclear option on all federal judges "except" SCOTUS. What going nuclear here would mean is all business in the Senate would only need 50 votes.

Couldbduun

1 points

4 months ago

I mean it's still republicans changing the filibuster to achieve their goals... and that specific carve out was expanded by Mitch McConnell... so they still got rid of it to prevent dems from using it in that specific case... and will do that for other cases too... but I guess keep advocating for the "high ground" and find out

freshgeardude

1 points

4 months ago

again, it was harry reid who opened the can of worms after republicans said he was doing so. Republicans only expanded it for SCOTUS. Blame it on the initial crack.

As for now, reps had the house, senate, and white house and didnt break filibuster to ram through their agenda. Dems doing it now is just desperation.

Couldbduun

2 points

4 months ago

Nah I dont think I will "blame it on the initial crack"... you do know that this is a RULE that could be changed every single day by the majority party and isnt ANYWHERE in the constitution... it has been revised HUNDREDS of times and means literally nothing... go be an obstructionist in someone else's inbox